…Rochas Okorocha jumped ship and said he was going to become the President of Nigeria

 

…through a democratic process, we can take our destiny into our own hands

 

 

In the current political climate in Nigeria, everybody wants to join the Political Party – the All Progressive Grand Alliance (APGA). And those who previously left because of one reason or the other are coming back to the party in good numbers. In essence, APGA is now the preferred Party for politicians who want to be relevant or win elections in Nigeria especially in the South East of Nigeria. This turn-around in the fortunes of the party was made possible by the 10-year hard work of the former Chairman, Senator (Dr) Victor Umeh and his formidable team. And, the current leadership of the party is working very hard to sustain the momentum.  

The erstwhile Chairman, Dr Victor Umeh is now a Senator of the Federal Republic of Nigeria representing Anambra Central District.  And, not long ago, he was on holiday in London and the Editor-In-Chief of The AMBASSADOR MAGAZINE, Sam Asoluka met and interviewed him. Below is the interview, please read.

As an APGA Senator, one can rightly say that you are one of Ikemba Ojukwu’s disciples. When Ikemba Ojukwu was pardoned in 1982 and he joined the National Party of National, he told the world that his mission was to take Ndi-Igbo back to the mainstream of Nigeria politics. What are you and other disciples doing to take Ndi-Igbo back to the mainstream of politics in Nigeria?

That reference has been made a couple of times by those who knew when Dim Ikemba Ojukwu came back from exile and joined the National Party of Nigeria. As at that time one can safely say that his return to Nigeria was a conditional return because he was in exile and some elements in the NPN decided to move for his unconditional pardon. I know that the late Dr Chuba Okadigbo and a few others played some roles to facilitate his return to Nigeria. A man who was eager to return to his fatherland after 12 years in exile had to come home and those who facilitated his return wanted to make political benefits from his return and that was why he joined the NPN.

It is good to point out that he joined the NPN. But he saw that the position of his people before and after the war and realised that Igbo have not made any significant progress. Despite that he joined the NPN, hoping that national politics would bring the Igbo back, but he was able to see it completely that the prejudices against the Igbo by successive Nigerian Government had remained consistent, that the Igbo should constantly be treated like conquered people from the war and everything done to deny them the opportunity to rise again.

He then drew the line and said the best thing to do is to come back home and organise the people of Igbo Nation under a Political Platform of their own, through which they can negotiate with the rest of Nigerians for their existence. Those who are quick to point out when Dim Ojukwu came back from exile and joined the National Party of Nigeria (NPN) have refused to say that, at a very critical time, Dim Ojukwu return to Regional politics, becoming the Leader of All Progressive Grand Alliance (APGA) and Chairman BOT, and remained with APGA until he died.

One therefore could say that Ojukwu was a man who saw different sides of a coin, tried to embrace National politics to address the wrongs against the Igbo, saw that he was not making any headway with that arrangement, he had to return to regional party to attempt to mobilise Igbo people with a view to uniting them as a block for the purpose of negotiating with Nigeria. That was the final thinking Dim Ojukwu had till he died.

Having worked with him very closely for years in APGA, he was the Chairman, BOT, I was the Party Chairman from 2005-2010. I can tell you that I was able to record Ojukwu’s views about Nigeria even towards his last years of active life. He became unapologetic about his last stand that Igbo must come together in one political party to be able to form a formidable block for the purpose of negotiating with the rest of Nigeria.

And, it was from that flank I have continued to move on with APGA. My view about the situation has not changed. I believe consistently that, the after effect of the war on Igbo have remained very debilitating in the sense that Igbo have not been able to regain their strength in Nigeria as a result of the conscious and deliberate actions taken by successive military regimes after the war. They did everything to ensure that Igbo were reduced to insignificance in the National decision-making process.

These things they were able to achieve by creating States and Local Governments. If you look at the history of Nigeria, apart from the old Western Region that was created in the First Republic, there is no other state or Local Government ever created through a civilian process, except by military fiat.

Gowon created 12 State, Murtala Mohammed created the additional making it 19 States. Successive military leaders continued to create. General Abacha left it at 36 States. In all these States and Local government creation, there was a common aggregate among those of them that fought the war, that had reins of power, changing baton from Gowon to Abacha. These were the leaders that created States and they made sure that as more states and Local Governments were created, the Igbo nation will continue to reduce in significance.

To put it squarely for you to understand, today there are six Geo-political zones in Nigeria. The South-East that is the Igbo Nation in outlook has 5 States, 95 Local Governments, South-South has 6 States 123 Local Governments, South West has 6 States and 137 Local Governments, North-West 7 States, Kano and Jigawa have 82 Local Governments, almost the size of the entire South East. And to drive home the skewed creation of states and LGs, in the Constitution they handed over to the civil administration in 1999, they listed all the States and Local Governments and went further to lay down the conditions to create additional States and Local Government Areas.

When you go and see those ‘conditions’ you will see that it will be easy for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for an additional state or LGA to be created. For you to create an additional State, you have to get the consent or approval of two-thirds of the Houses of Assembly in Nigeria. And, that’s 24 states minimum. As we are structured now, there are 19 States in Northern Nigeria and 17 in Southern Nigeria. So, you have to get at least 7 more States from Northern Nigeria to support you to pass anything. And, it is impossible in the way things are run in Nigeria. 

Now if you want to recruit people into the armed forces or Federal Agencies, it is done on the basis of Local Government. The worst of it all is that Revenue sharing in Nigeria is also done on the basis of Local Government and States. So anything in Nigeria that is available for sharing under any arrangement, Igbo continue to take the least because they have the least of LGs and States. That’s how our marginalisation is rooted on. And there is nothing you can do to change it. That’s why some of us have looked at it wholesomely and believed that the only thing that will save the situation is to Restructure Nigeria and curtail the imbalances even in our aspiration to be the President of Nigeria.   

I can tell you APGA remains the only answer to Igbo finding their feet in Nigeria political terrain. The way we are presently acclaimed will not give us any prominence. We get swallowed in the big parties, you are drowned during decision making. If you can stay on your own in APGA, that way, nobody can ignore the Igbo people. We are over 50 million and we are all over Nigeria. So if we identify with one party, vote in one direction, there is no way you can form a government in Nigeria without the Igbo.

Every election time, the battle is in Igboland and we should realise that the attitude of the Nigerian government towards the Igbo never change. And in what Ojukwu said to me ‘if somebody does not love you, you must make the person be afraid of you. Once you don’t show somebody who doesn’t love you that he can do away with you or deal with you any way he wishes. 

And those on the political chessboard now put Igbo in the background, saying what can they do, they are scattered, they can’t put on a block vote. This is what the Igbo have not come to see as a major weakness in Nigeria. If we come to that understanding, if we stay together, we will be a formidable group in Nigeria. Anybody who is telling you that anybody is making a plan to share power with Ndi-Igbo is deceiving you. They don’t have that plan. If so, what they have done wouldn’t have been inserted into the constitution.

A lot of people have been frustrated. You can see the IPOB, MASSOB, all these agitations are as a result of frustrations. When the system is impervious to change you will see all kinds of agitation. And, when the agitation comes from the Igbo land, the might of the Federal Government will be unleashed on them. So going forward and through a democratic process, we can take our destiny into our own hands. 

Your Party APGA has this catchy slogan ‘nkaa bu nke anyi’. But it is in control of only Anambra State. What is the Party doing to win in other States especially in the South-East and South-South Nigeria?

Well, ‘nkaa bu nke anyi‘ is a slogan which was developed through the leadership of Chief Willie Obiano. It was a mantra we developed in the last governorship election in Anambra state. In truth and fact, APGA remains the party that was founded through the efforts of Igbo people. APGA originated in the South East. Every party has its origin.

Nobody should feel shy to say that APGA was founded through the initiatives of Igbo people. The PDP which claims to be a National Party became a national party from the North. President Buhari’s Congress for Progressive Change (CPC) was from the North. At a time it had no office anywhere in Nigeria except in Northern Nigeria. Through coalition, APP and CPC which are Northern Parties and ACN, a Western Party, formed APC. So, all these Parties have their origin from one place or another. And, in terms of looking at National affairs and issues, it’s obvious that APGA is the party that is preaching accommodation in all parts of Nigeria. We believe that APGA having been registered with our dominant people in it, can be safely described as our own. Because I cannot see how APGA can at anytime compromise on the interest of the people.

Today, yes APGA is controlling one state in Nigeria. But under my chairmanship of APGA, I extended the Party to Imo State in 2011. I came in there to lead the election both in campaign, coordination and execution which brought Rochas Okorocha in as the Governor of Imo State. When we fought very hard and achieved victory, I was very happy and was looking forward to APGA growing to take over the remaining states in Igbo land but unfortunately, we used the wrong horse for the race. Rochas Okorocha jumped ship and said he was going to become the President of Nigeria. That APGA was a small Political Party, that he wouldn’t achieve his ambition in APGA. At least he told me that by himself. And I told him that he will never get what he was looking for. I begged him not to leave APGA but he moved away. We stayed on.

Today I am sure if you see him his story would have changed. Because he’s gone the way he did, called us all kinds of names, called APGA a religion, a mushroom party, etc. It goes to show that, if you look at the surface you wouldn’t understand the problem Igbo people are facing. But if you look at it deeply, you will know that Igbo people are the people who will fight for themselves, defend themselves and emancipate themselves. Nobody can call you in Nigeria and give you power. Nobody will say that you have been trying too much, come and take this or that, it’s not possible.

The setback we suffered was when Rochas Okorocha left APGA. So, losing a State Government is not a small loss. Even in 2015, Alex Oti won the election in Abia State. APGA won in 14 Local Governments out the 17 Local Governments in the Gubernatorial election but they used rigging to frustrate Alex Oti. In 2015 it would have been Anambra, Imo and Abia States. The other States would have just fallen in 2019 elections. But the journey will continue.

In Imo State, in particular, there are over 20 Candidates aspiring to fly the APGA’s Governorship flag in 2019; Are these candidates lining up to win or to ‘kill’ the party in the State?

Well, I think having been the National Chairman of APGA for 10 years, I can tell you why certain things happen. Before 2011, Imo State was angling to APGA to take over the reins of power in the State. Imo has always been an APGA State since 2003. Imo State is a core Igbo State in content and character. Imo People can be described as true Igbo people. So, I am not surprised that at every election time they will always take towards APGA because they see it as Igbo Party. The one they call their own. Imo and Anambra states have always stayed together politically. When we won Imo State in 2011 and Okorocha went away with it, you could see that they have never relaxed to Okorocha’s Government. If you look at what had played out in the last few years, you could see that Imo people have been struggling to break away from where they found themselves in a party called APC. That is not the type of place they operate naturally. So when Anambra spoke in the governorship election of 17 November 2018, when APGA won in 21 Local Governments, and two months after, in my own Senatorial election, APGA won in all the Local Governments. The direction changed and People of the South East celebrated both victories. APGA now became the singsong everywhere in Igbo land

So with the governorship election coming and the malfeasance going on in Imo State in the name of the government of Rochas Okorocha, the people of Imo State have now seen APGA as the only place they can go to be able to take back their State. And, that is why anybody who wants to run for election in Imo State today is declaring for APGA. It’s natural. Events clearly point to the direction that if you want to win, it’s APGA that you will stand on and win.

I have not been looking at all of them but quite frankly the number of the governorship aspirants is staggering. We have to look at it with a lot of anxiety. There are some who will jostle for the ticket, if they don’t get it they will turn back and instigate a crisis in the party. That’s what the present APGA leadership must watch and prevent from happening. In a nutshell, there are so many aspirants for the office of governor of Imo State because of the goodwill APGA has following the Anambra State governorship election and the redirection of the minds of Igbo people in Nigeria politics. 

The people of Anambra have done a lot for Igbo in general but of recent, there is this ‘Anambra first’ and Igbo Second politics emerging from the state, what’s gone wrong and why?

I don’t think it’s correct, with an exception. What happened, because of the type of roles we have played in the history of Igbo people, our brothers and sisters from other States think that Anambra people are always in front. It is not true because there is a way we approach things. If we are convinced that this is the right way to go, we put everything into it including resources and fight to the end.

In the 2003 election, APGA had a generally good showing in Imo, Abia, Enugu, Anambra and Ebonyi States. But it was only in Anambra that we fought through the courts to restore the governorship mandate of APGA. Even when they did not give us any chance. We fought on and got it after 30 months, almost the length of the civil war. Those my colleagues in other States gave up on the way. Only Chief Ugo Agballa tried in Enugu State but not with the strength with which we pursued it in Anambra State.

And, when they say Anambra thinks Anambra first, I don’t think it’s so. When Dim Ojukwu led the old Eastern Region, the people decided that he declare the Republic of Biafra and he happened to be the Military Head of State. He did not look back in pursuit of that declaration. He put everything his father Sir Louis Ojukwu had at risk to save the Igbo people, to stand on the part of restoring the dignity of the Igboman.

Today Ojukwu’s wealth is littered in Lagos, many properties were confiscated in Lagos. Ojukwu did not consider himself as coming from that kind of privileged parentage. He turned his back on wealth and went into that war and it ended the way it ended. And, Ojukwu remained a special breed because he never came back to pursue all those earthly things. He said leadership and acquisition of wealth do not go together. If you want to provide leadership, forget the acquisition of wealth that’s why most people in leadership position failed.

In an interview with a Nigerian Newspaper, foremost Statesman, Chief Mbazulike Amaechi, accused Igbo leaders of betraying the Indigenous People of Biafra (IPOB)  and other Biafra agitators. Did Igbo Leaders betray Biafra agitators?

I think Chief Mbazuluike Amechi remains one of the best of the exiting leaders in Igbo land. He has a deep sense of history and recollection, having been involved in the politics of Nigeria from a tender age. He became a Minister at the age of 25 or thereabouts. He was in the Zikist Movement. He can also be described as one who has seen it all in Nigeria. He is a fine politician with the courage to speak when it is necessary to speak.

To say that the elite abandoned IPOB, I don’t agree with him in that statement because he may have said it out of frustration. Maybe, he expected a line of action which he did not see. But a lot of people share in the sentiment expressed by the IPOB.

When the issue of IPOB and MASSOB came up, I told Nigerians not to make the mistake of thinking that these youths do not enjoy the support of the elite and the leaders of Igbo land. What they are complaining against is the marginalisation of Igbo people. And both the elite encounter this marginalisation. The Igbo question stares you at the face in your private career. Every Igbo support them because of the imbalance and marginalisation but disagree on the method. But whether they agree with it in principle, they do. Even those in business tell you what they suffer daily in their businesses. 

So, if what Pa Mbazulike Amechi expected the Igbo elite to do is to shut down Igbo Nation, don’t take part in elections is the way out, it’s not. We are all involved in the process.

When Raph Uwazuruike was arrested in 2012 by the police in Enugu, I spoke to the then Commissioner of Police in Enugu as the National Chairman of APGA. I told him that I am a member of MASSOB. I was the one who signed their bail bond to release them from the Magistrate Court. I asked them what is MASSOB? Have they killed anybody, do they carry arms? Why can’t you address the issues? We don’t kill people, we are fighting for justice without violence, we don’t kill anybody. Today in Nigeria herdsmen are killing people every day, what has happened to them?

I don’t think the IPOB has been abandoned. What you see is the silence of the graveyard. People are looking at it from various approaches. I believe that today the best thing we should do is to engage Nigeria along the constitutional line because once you say you don’t agree with what is going on and the only option is to be disobedient to the laws of the country, there will be reasons to come after you.

We have to use what the law allows to fight for our redemption in Nigeria. We have done it through war it didn’t work. And because of that, the policy now is to never to allow Igbo people to rise again. But the Igbo have gone beyond where they thought they will never be again since the war ended. What is sustaining Igbo people in Nigeria is God.

So, Pa Amechi, that’s what I call him. We see these things and understand the issue very well. What I expected the Nigerian government to do is to call the IPOB and MASSOB Leaders and ask them why they don’t want to be part of Nigeria again. They will give you their reasons. The things they are facing – frustration, discrimination, lack of equal opportunity. They give you the reason and you change the policy or agree with them.

I am sorry Pa Amechi had to say this. He said it out of frustration. I personally know that it will not be forever. But what is important is to keep the struggle alive, don’t be conquered by fear. Time will come and people will confess to what they have done to our people.

What IPOB and MASSOB represent and fighting for in today’s Nigeria is not easy for them, but they will not be suppressed forever. There will surely be a time when a Daniel will come to judgement in Nigeria.

Some Nigeria Diaspora Organizations have been positively Marketing Nigeria as a profitable destination for Trade and Investment. The recent was the forum organised by the Council of Igbo Communities (CIC), UK. As a Member of the Senate Committee on Trade and Investment, what’s your advice to these groups and how can they effectively leverage on the Resources of the Senate.

Well at the Senate we just amended the Company and Allied Matters Act with a view to making business easy in Nigeria. Nigeria is a virgin compared to countries like the UK, US etc. If you go to Nigeria, you will know that we have not even started. In the UK you have large Businesses with the capacity to drive development. There are companies in the UK that have over £8 billion budget per annum There are multi-national companies that even do the budget of Nigeria.

We do business as individuals in Nigeria. We have not been able to create businesses that are visible in the international space. Business opportunities are many and people who want to come can come. But the issue is that people have not started coming to put together business capital to enable them to do big things. So, Nigeria is still a place where investment opportunities abound.

We have also done Petroleum industry Bill in the Senate to make our petroleum sector to be competitive like in other countries of the world that have oil. We have also done the final work on the Host Communities’ bill. That is, how do Communities who God has given their land oil benefit from the oil which the Nigeria Government has taken by force. Some of these things are things we have done to promote businesses.

In each sector, people can come and invest in the areas they want. We are also looking at the Tax laws to see what we can do so that foreign investors can see Nigeria as the right destination to go. What we need is sincerity of purpose. A businessman coming to Nigeria with a view to doing honest business, making a profit and making Nigeria develop through the process and not coming to exploit us. Such things are no longer possible because the country is growing.

For the Council of Igbo Communities, let them come. There are so many things to do in Nigeria. There is no money you put in Nigeria, that you will not have a reasonable return. No matter what is dividing us, Nigeria is open to all investors. We want them to come in and create jobs. Unemployment is a great problem in Nigeria today. And, we are looking forward to having those who can come with the big businesses. We have a lot of resources given to us by God. We have land, a good climate and we don’t suffer from natural disasters. Nigeria is on a firm ground. I encourage people with good intentions to come to Nigeria and invest. I am looking at Nigeria of years to come. We have the contacts of people both in private and government. We can link people referred to us, let them come.

Distinguished Senator, in 2017, Nigerians in Diaspora remitted over $21billion into the Nigerian Economy, but they don’t have the right to vote in any elections in Nigeria. What’s your take on the right of Nigerians in Diaspora to vote in Elections in Nigeria.

In the 58 years of Independence, the military ruled for 35years. Our democracy is work in progress. To experiment with Diaspora voting or things of that sort, will be possible when institutions have been strengthened and the electoral Commission becomes clearly very independent to discharge their functions.

Even to conduct and manage election in Nigeria is a big challenge and we are working hard on that. How much more when you open the doors for votes to fly in from other countries of the world where Nigerians are said to live. Those in Nigeria might finish voting and one day you hear that Nigerians in Australia have put 15 million votes for somebody. How do you manage the confusion?

This type of thing is possible when we have put in place a system where Nigerians living in any country in the world is properly identified and documented so that if elections would take place and there are, for instance, two million verifiable voters in the UK, Nigerians would accept those numbers.

It can be open to abuse. How we manage Diaspora voting is a technical challenge. Not that it’s not good, it is good. If we use the UK and US standard, what about the people that live in the other parts of the world. Can we manage it? Do we have our Foreign Missions up to the standard they are ought to be in all these countries like France, Spain, Belgium, etc? It’s a big challenge.

Thank you, Senator.